TownHallMeetingLog20091217

OSGrid Town Hall Meeting log from 2009-12-17

Note: times in log are US/Pacific

[2009/12/16 16:08] Dave Coyle: so, first off thanks again everyone for coming. i have two items to discuss...
[2009/12/16 16:08] Marcus Llewellyn: Good idea. They can explode when they hit the ground after driving off the edge.
[2009/12/16 16:08] Nebadon Izumi: k ya lets get things rolling
[2009/12/16 16:08] Dave Coyle: first, with many people celebrating holidays in the next couple of weeks and/or travelling, things are more quiet that usual
[2009/12/16 16:08] Eryn Galen: wow, crowded, lol
[2009/12/16 16:09] Dave Coyle: so we're going to cancel the next two meetings
[2009/12/16 16:09] Dave Coyle: december 24 and 31
[2009/12/16 16:09] Eryn Galen: hehe, good idea Dave
[2009/12/16 16:09] Eryn Galen: Hi Moni :)
[2009/12/16 16:09] Dave Coyle: so after tonight, the next town hall meeting will be january 7
[2009/12/16 16:09] Monerda Skute: hey Eryn and everyonw ;)
[2009/12/16 16:09] Dave Coyle: same time & place
[2009/12/16 16:10] Adelle Fitzgerald: hiya Monerda
[2009/12/16 16:10] Dave Coyle: hi
[2009/12/16 16:10] Warin Cascabel: Hello, Monerda
[2009/12/16 16:10] Greybeard Thinker: greetings all
[2009/12/16 16:10] Monerda Skute: hola
[2009/12/16 16:10] Warin Cascabel: Hello, Greybeard
[2009/12/16 16:10] Dave Coyle: the other item i had... IRC.
[2009/12/16 16:10] Adelle Fitzgerald: hiya Greybeard
[2009/12/16 16:11] Dave Coyle: if there were a jabber chat room bridged with our #osgrid IRC channel on freenode, would anyone find that useful?
[2009/12/16 16:11] Nebadon Izumi: or as i like to call it "Irattating Recconnect Contraption"
[2009/12/16 16:11] Greybeard Thinker: Hi Warin, Adelle, Moni Marc, Neb and crew
[2009/12/16 16:11] Dave Coyle: haha
[2009/12/16 16:11] Monerda Skute: lol
[2009/12/16 16:11] Arielle Popstar: Hi Randt and graybeard
[2009/12/16 16:11] Warin Cascabel: What are the benefits of doing so, Dave?
[2009/12/16 16:11] Shez Oyen: I don't know what jabber is
[2009/12/16 16:12] Dave Coyle: jabber, now officially called XMPP, is an IM protocol
[2009/12/16 16:12] Greybeard Thinker: jabber? irc client?
[2009/12/16 16:12] Dave Coyle: warin, i guess it depends on one's preferences
[2009/12/16 16:13] Dave Coyle: i've heard people say from time to time they hate IRC
[2009/12/16 16:13] Dave Coyle: i guess i'm just trying to find out if there are people not participating in our irc channel because it's irc
[2009/12/16 16:13] Dave Coyle: for whatever reason
[2009/12/16 16:13] Shez Oyen: I was using the built in Emeld IRC it was GREAT, but I noticed I wasn't getting ny ambient sounds so had to swith to Hippo :/
[2009/12/16 16:13] Greybeard Thinker: because I can't seem to get it to work for me?
[2009/12/16 16:13] Dave Coyle: emerald has a built in irc client? cool.
[2009/12/16 16:13] Warin Cascabel: Well, if it'll open things up for more people, it sounds good to me.
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: I'm using Chatzilla now
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: it was really nice having it built into the client
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: :/
[2009/12/16 16:14] Greybeard Thinker: Emerald also isn't very OSGrid friendly.
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: no it doesn't seem to be
[2009/12/16 16:14] Nebadon Izumi: ya im using Chatzilla now too in xulrunner
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: I'm spoiled bu it.. I love the built in AO
[2009/12/16 16:14] Nebadon Izumi: i just upgraded today
[2009/12/16 16:14] Monerda Skute: in what way ?
[2009/12/16 16:14] Shez Oyen: so you don't walk like a dork in no script zones
[2009/12/16 16:14] Dave Coyle: greybeard, are you saying you've had problems with IRC? or were you talking about emerald?
[2009/12/16 16:14] Adelle Fitzgerald: did it just update easily, Neb?
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2009/12/16 16:15] Adelle Fitzgerald: cool
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: just run same routine again
[2009/12/16 16:15] Greybeard Thinker: both Dave lol.
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: all i did
[2009/12/16 16:15] Adelle Fitzgerald: i didnt know how it would take being run in xulrunner
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: ya me either
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: just just download the zip and drop it in
[2009/12/16 16:15] Nebadon Izumi: run the command line thingy
[2009/12/16 16:15] Adelle Fitzgerald: cool
[2009/12/16 16:16] SpecialAgent Randt: Tx
[2009/12/16 16:16] Arielle Popstar: yw
[2009/12/16 16:16] Marcus Llewellyn: While I'm not a major fan of IRC as the focal point for communications, it really comes down to users taking adavantage of any communication channel provided. You can have all the blogs, tweets, forums, chat channels or office hours you like... but it's up to people to care enough to take note and participate.
[2009/12/16 16:16] Greybeard Thinker: yes agreed Marc
[2009/12/16 16:16] Eryn Galen: true
[2009/12/16 16:16] Adelle Fitzgerald: i agree with Marcus
[2009/12/16 16:17] Eryn Galen: Im lazy. I just use the web version
[2009/12/16 16:17] Adelle Fitzgerald: if people actually want to communicate, they will make it possible
[2009/12/16 16:17] Greybeard Thinker: same here
[2009/12/16 16:17] Arielle Popstar: does the region i own need to be irc enabled?
[2009/12/16 16:17] Dave Coyle: marcus: i agree. and i'm not entirely sold on the idea (of adding a jabber bridge). but it's easy (i already did the work) so just wondering if it's worth turning on.
[2009/12/16 16:17] Adelle Fitzgerald: and personally, im not a fan of IM clients
[2009/12/16 16:17] Greybeard Thinker: Adelle, Ive never got one to work for me
[2009/12/16 16:17] Dave Coyle: arielle, no, we're not talking about the in-world IRC bridge. this is the external #osgrid support channel.
[2009/12/16 16:17] Eryn Galen: Hi Key
[2009/12/16 16:18] Arielle Popstar: ok Dave
[2009/12/16 16:18] Key Gruin: HI Eryn, everyone
[2009/12/16 16:18] Greybeard Thinker: Hi Key
[2009/12/16 16:18] Adelle Fitzgerald: hi Key
[2009/12/16 16:18] Marcus Llewellyn: Well... When it comes to jabber, I think the question if whether there are popular, well know clients that make use if it. Google Talk does, and many linux and/or cross IM protocol clients do... but are those what most people have installed?
[2009/12/16 16:18] Monerda Skute: hi Key
[2009/12/16 16:18] Arielle Popstar: hi Key
[2009/12/16 16:18] Arielle Popstar: i like the idea
[2009/12/16 16:19] Dave Coyle: so it sounds like no one here sees a pressing need for something like this.
[2009/12/16 16:20] Marcus Llewellyn: I'm not at all opposed to it, so long as the bridge is a clean transparent one for both jabber and IRC users.
[2009/12/16 16:20] Dave Coyle: so hows about.... i have it, but won't turn it on. but if you come across people saying this is something they would benefit from, point them my way.
[2009/12/16 16:20] Adelle Fitzgerald: its not something I would ever use, Dave, but im not against it
[2009/12/16 16:20] Arielle Popstar: i been doing some hypergridding and it would be nice to talk to some people in osgrid at the same time
[2009/12/16 16:20] Warin Cascabel: Well, I'd be using the same client anyway, regardless of what protocol.
[2009/12/16 16:20] Greybeard Thinker: what about that PSMB?
[2009/12/16 16:20] Arielle Popstar: without having to add those people to a regular im client
[2009/12/16 16:20] Dave Coyle: it would be transparent on both sides. but it's yet another thing to keep working.
[2009/12/16 16:21] Dave Coyle: so if it's not going to get much use, i don't think it's worth the effort of keeping it going.
[2009/12/16 16:21] Warin Cascabel: Then, sure, don't bother with it until people really want to use it.
[2009/12/16 16:21] Marcus Llewellyn: There's only one way to see if it gets use... turn it on. :) Maybe we'll be suprised.
[2009/12/16 16:21] Key Gruin: excuse me, but what is "it"
[2009/12/16 16:21] Dave Coyle: jabber chat room <-> irc bridge
[2009/12/16 16:22] Key Gruin: ah ok
[2009/12/16 16:22] Dave Coyle: wondering if we'd broaden the involvement of people in #osgrid
[2009/12/16 16:22] Dave Coyle: but sounds like probably not
[2009/12/16 16:22] Greybeard Thinker: first thing to do is convince them this is nat actually a "game" Dave.
[2009/12/16 16:23] Key Gruin: would it be able to be intergrated into the clients? or need a seperate client
[2009/12/16 16:23] Marcus Llewellyn: The problem with the IRC channel isn't the fact that it's on IRC, IMO. It's that as a support tool it's a sort of ephemeral tool. Valueable info is here one minute, and potentially gone the next. But we *do* have forums.
[2009/12/16 16:23] Dave Coyle: key: which clients? this would have no connection in-world, if that's what you're asking.
[2009/12/16 16:23] Dave Coyle: marcus: agreed
[2009/12/16 16:24] Key Gruin: yes Dave, thats what I meant
[2009/12/16 16:24] Key Gruin: viewers
[2009/12/16 16:24] Greybeard Thinker: we need someone who can work up a new Hippo version then?
[2009/12/16 16:25] Monerda Skute: Randt
[2009/12/16 16:25] Monerda Skute: *:::* WELCOME BACK *:::*
[2009/12/16 16:25] Arielle Popstar: a new hippo version?
[2009/12/16 16:25] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2009/12/16 16:25] SpecialAgent Randt: I have never crashed this often...
[2009/12/16 16:25] Key Gruin: lol now it's being said that meerkat is going down the tubes
[2009/12/16 16:25] Dave Coyle: more viewer devs would be great. but a lot of people don't want to touch the viewer because they can't submit code to opensim for 6 months.
[2009/12/16 16:25] SpecialAgent Randt: I'm using Hippo.
[2009/12/16 16:25] Nebadon Izumi: strange SpecialAgent, ive notice anyone else crash
[2009/12/16 16:25] Greybeard Thinker: uhuh
[2009/12/16 16:25] Dave Coyle: yeah, meerkat is dead
[2009/12/16 16:25] Nebadon Izumi: maybe just internet problems at the moment
[2009/12/16 16:25] Shez Oyen: Yeah! Add IRC, a good AO and Dancer!
[2009/12/16 16:26] Monerda Skute: I like that idea Shez
[2009/12/16 16:26] Greybeard Thinker: how much do yoo want a viewer to do?
[2009/12/16 16:26] Shez Oyen: Die hard Emerld user but I give up.. it can't do sound on the new Mac
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: well
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: if the viewer had better HTML web brwoser
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: like it could open 10 windows
[2009/12/16 16:26] Greybeard Thinker: yes Neb.
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: instead of just 1
[2009/12/16 16:26] Monerda Skute: Shez I run Emerald on the Snow Leopard and music worls for me
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: then we could have web chat in the viewer
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: plus other tools
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: its coming
[2009/12/16 16:26] Nebadon Izumi: thats the big hubub of SL 2.0 really
[2009/12/16 16:27] Greybeard Thinker: a nice shiny new viewer in web browser?
[2009/12/16 16:27] Shez Oyen: /clap
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: it will be a proper web browser
[2009/12/16 16:27] Dave Coyle: tabbed viewer?
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: basiclly
[2009/12/16 16:27] Eryn Galen: oohhh, nice
[2009/12/16 16:27] Dave Coyle: wow. that so... underwhelming.
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: right
[2009/12/16 16:27] Warin Cascabel: Heh
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: it might have some basic mesh stuff
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: and shadows
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: but ya
[2009/12/16 16:27] Greybeard Thinker: nice Neb
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: mostly deflating baloon noise
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: in the end
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: but it will be good i think
[2009/12/16 16:27] Nebadon Izumi: just not as dramatic as most expect
[2009/12/16 16:27] Greybeard Thinker: I did install the 3Di plugin for Firefow
[2009/12/16 16:28] Shez Oyen: Snow Leapord? I think I am OS X, I am VERY new to Mac
[2009/12/16 16:28] Dave Coyle: "For Immediate Release: SL now has the same thing you've had on your desktop since 1998"
[2009/12/16 16:28] Greybeard Thinker: anyonme know how to trnaslate Japanese? lol.
[2009/12/16 16:28] Snoopy Pfeffer is Offline
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: lol dave
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: ya maybe one day just like every video game on earth
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: you will also be able to set your own keys
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: wouldnt that be something
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2009/12/16 16:28] Nebadon Izumi: be just like Windows 3.1
[2009/12/16 16:28] SpecialAgent Randt: Ok this is the Snowglobe viewer...
[2009/12/16 16:29] Greybeard Thinker: just click a favourites in your web browser and be inworld?
[2009/12/16 16:29] Greybeard Thinker: sweeee.
[2009/12/16 16:29] Nebadon Izumi: ya it will be cool once we can open more than 1 browser
[2009/12/16 16:29] Nebadon Izumi: and put web pages on huds
[2009/12/16 16:29] Nebadon Izumi: that we can interact with
[2009/12/16 16:30] Nebadon Izumi: even flash type animated menus
[2009/12/16 16:30] Nebadon Izumi: that would be really cool
[2009/12/16 16:30] Key Gruin: that wuld be great for the newspaper
[2009/12/16 16:30] Warin Cascabel: As long as the web-page-on-a-HUD would actually send data back *to* the HUD.
[2009/12/16 16:30] Nebadon Izumi: ya thats what i mean
[2009/12/16 16:30] Greybeard Thinker: erm, hasn't Flash got some vulnerability woes right now?
[2009/12/16 16:30] Nebadon Izumi: like a proper functioning webpage
[2009/12/16 16:30] Nebadon Izumi: its not impossible to do
[2009/12/16 16:31] Nebadon Izumi: then you could even like log into secure sites
[2009/12/16 16:31] Nebadon Izumi: via webpage on a prim
[2009/12/16 16:31] Key Gruin: they can jput a man on the moon, why can't we have a good inworld web browser
[2009/12/16 16:31] Arielle Popstar: uhm...is this a town meeting or a dev one?
[2009/12/16 16:31] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe
[2009/12/16 16:31] Nebadon Izumi: hehe were dreaming
[2009/12/16 16:31] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2009/12/16 16:31] Adelle Fitzgerald: haha
[2009/12/16 16:31] Nebadon Izumi: most of this stuff is not happening anytime soon
[2009/12/16 16:31] Dave Coyle: yeah, we kinda got sidetracked
[2009/12/16 16:31] SpecialAgent Randt: I'm not sure we can put a man on the moon anymore.
[2009/12/16 16:32] Greybeard Thinker: Neb, I like the new decor here, seating works.
[2009/12/16 16:32] Dave Coyle: anyone else have any osgrid-related items they'd like to discuss?
[2009/12/16 16:32] Adelle Fitzgerald: they actually put a man on the moon with nothing more powerful than a BBC model B :)
[2009/12/16 16:32] Key Gruin: have to agree with ya SpecialA
[2009/12/16 16:32] Marcus Llewellyn: Sure we can. Do you want a living man on the moon is the question. A dead one is easy. :)
[2009/12/16 16:32] Nebadon Izumi: ya finally remembered to do it
[2009/12/16 16:32] Nebadon Izumi: these are Adams chairs he put out a few
[2009/12/16 16:32] Nebadon Izumi: i finished it off
[2009/12/16 16:32] Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[2009/12/16 16:32] Greybeard Thinker: they're nice
[2009/12/16 16:32] Nebadon Izumi: ya its much cozier feeling now
[2009/12/16 16:32] Eryn Galen: nice Neb
[2009/12/16 16:32] Greybeard Thinker: one thing about Bade itself?
[2009/12/16 16:32] Warin Cascabel: Huh, that's weird. I wonder what a *purple* dot means on the minimap.
[2009/12/16 16:33] Jacek Antonelli grins
[2009/12/16 16:33] Marcus Llewellyn: That's a teletubby, Warin. Tinky-winky.
[2009/12/16 16:33] Greybeard Thinker: is it possible to get the teleport with level names on it?
[2009/12/16 16:33] Zardoz Firanelli: I was noticing those too
[2009/12/16 16:33] Warin Cascabel: Ha, Marcus.
[2009/12/16 16:33] Warin Cascabel: I'm guessing, given Jacek's grin, that a purple dot means Jacek.
[2009/12/16 16:33] Dave Coyle: hi jacek
[2009/12/16 16:33] Jacek Antonelli: It means an Imprudence developer, yes. :)
[2009/12/16 16:33] Warin Cascabel: Aha. :)
[2009/12/16 16:33] Jacek Antonelli: Hello all
[2009/12/16 16:33] Warin Cascabel: Howdy.
[2009/12/16 16:34] Eryn Galen: hi Jacek
[2009/12/16 16:34] Dave Coyle: any other osgrid items? going once.... going twice...
[2009/12/16 16:34] Nebadon Izumi: nothing i can think of
[2009/12/16 16:34] Arielle Popstar: Not seeing a lot of greeters in lbsa lately
[2009/12/16 16:34] Greybeard Thinker: better ways to teach noobs?
[2009/12/16 16:34] Marcus Llewellyn: Yes... let's get a working world map, please. :)
[2009/12/16 16:34] Nebadon Izumi: everyones been very busy with holidays and such
[2009/12/16 16:34] Arielle Popstar: so a lot of lost newcomers
[2009/12/16 16:34] Nebadon Izumi: im sure after the holidays it will be back to normal
[2009/12/16 16:34] Zardoz Firanelli: An opensim troble shooting list maybe?
[2009/12/16 16:35] Zardoz Firanelli: trouble*
[2009/12/16 16:35] Dave Coyle: yeah, i have a half-finished world map. but holiday time is a mess for me.
[2009/12/16 16:35] Greybeard Thinker: that's the forum Zardoz
[2009/12/16 16:35] Key Gruin: lbsa has been somewhat self-service it seems
[2009/12/16 16:35] Arielle Popstar: it has
[2009/12/16 16:36] Greybeard Thinker: even with Warins big flashing arrows half the noobs seem incapable of finding things.
[2009/12/16 16:36] Warin Cascabel: Heh
[2009/12/16 16:36] Key Gruin: lol
[2009/12/16 16:36] Monerda Skute: hi Hiro
[2009/12/16 16:36] Arielle Popstar: people leaving as fast they come
[2009/12/16 16:36] Nebadon Izumi: ya its impossible to have greeters there 24/7
[2009/12/16 16:36] Hiro Protagonist: Howdeh
[2009/12/16 16:36] Eryn Galen: Hi Hiro :)
[2009/12/16 16:36] Nebadon Izumi: hello Hiro
[2009/12/16 16:36] Greybeard Thinker: Hiro San greetings
[2009/12/16 16:36] Zardoz Firanelli: A bot maybe?
[2009/12/16 16:36] Dave Coyle: hola hiro
[2009/12/16 16:36] Nebadon Izumi: maybe bots are a bit unreliable though
[2009/12/16 16:36] Arielle Popstar: but with Andress busy on her own region, there has been very liittle
[2009/12/16 16:36] Richardus Raymaker is Offline
[2009/12/16 16:37] Greybeard Thinker: and really stupid too Neb.
[2009/12/16 16:37] Marcus Llewellyn: Bots won't be helpful for more than scripted tidbits, really.
[2009/12/16 16:37] Adelle Fitzgerald: also greeters come and go, they do it of their own free will, and people move on. we havent had any new greeters start for a while
[2009/12/16 16:37] Greybeard Thinker: bots I mean, not Andress
[2009/12/16 16:37] Dave Coyle: is a bot going to be more intuitive than a big moving green arrow pointing at the thing you're supposed to click?
[2009/12/16 16:37] Zardoz Firanelli: Yes, but they allways have the same questions...
[2009/12/16 16:37] Eryn Galen: lol Grey
[2009/12/16 16:37] Arielle Popstar: well a 3 month waiting period...
[2009/12/16 16:37] Zardoz Firanelli: And just make it spew if someone close is less than 2 days old
[2009/12/16 16:37] Greybeard Thinker: maybe a bot could answer those doofus Q's?
[2009/12/16 16:37] Key Gruin: someone still has to be there to say "look for the green arrow" lol
[2009/12/16 16:38] Eryn Galen: lol
[2009/12/16 16:38] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe Key
[2009/12/16 16:38] Adelle Fitzgerald: as sson as OI is up and running, that should sort 90% of the common questions
[2009/12/16 16:38] Nebadon Izumi: hehe ya we cant hold everyones hand
[2009/12/16 16:38] Marcus Llewellyn whispers: Some questions could be solved by osgrid itself. For example... why, oh why is the default AV still no mod? We could eliminate
[2009/12/16 16:38] Greybeard Thinker: hehe you funny Adelle
[2009/12/16 16:38] Marcus Llewellyn: "How do I change my appearance" very easily with that gone
[2009/12/16 16:38] Hiro Protagonist: it sounds as if I came in one the backside of a "What can we do to dumb this down sufficiently a chimp can do it" discussion
[2009/12/16 16:38] Nebadon Izumi: this world does require a bit of independance as well
[2009/12/16 16:38] Zardoz Firanelli: Or get rid of ruth and use the gas ball...
[2009/12/16 16:38] Greybeard Thinker: yes Neb
[2009/12/16 16:38] Dave Coyle: marcus: that'd be a good question for the opensim dev meeting
[2009/12/16 16:38] Eryn Galen: lol Hiro
[2009/12/16 16:38] Simulator Version shouts: OpenSim 0.6.9 (Dev) 9fd9211 2009-11-28 09:23:26 +0000 (OS Debian GNU/Linux 5.0
[2009/12/16 16:38] Eryn Galen: you got it
[2009/12/16 16:39] Arielle Popstar: also requires telling people that tp'ing in and out of plaza's is not always possible
[2009/12/16 16:39] Greybeard Thinker: can we incorporate an IQ test in the sign up process?
[2009/12/16 16:39] Greybeard Thinker: lol.
[2009/12/16 16:39] Warin Cascabel: Well, perhaps if avatars can be given a default inventory - including a modifiable avatar that they're set to wear rather than the no-mod one...
[2009/12/16 16:39] Eryn Galen: I honestly think, do we really want those ppl who cant even find the very visibly announced board?
[2009/12/16 16:39] Key Gruin: I don't think we want to make it *too* easy
[2009/12/16 16:39] Adelle Fitzgerald: i agree
[2009/12/16 16:40] Key Gruin: filter out the morons lol
[2009/12/16 16:40] Zardoz Firanelli: You have to have a little bit of Zoo time...
[2009/12/16 16:40] Greybeard Thinker: this grid and the devs need some intelect to help out
[2009/12/16 16:40] Arielle Popstar: make it only for the really intelligent?
[2009/12/16 16:40] Greybeard Thinker: not "gamers".
[2009/12/16 16:40] Arielle Popstar: not sure i am liking this direction people
[2009/12/16 16:40] Nebadon Izumi: but also dont forget we are open to suggestions, best thing you can do is build examples
[2009/12/16 16:40] Greybeard Thinker: yep
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: if you think something can be done better, show us
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: dont just talk about it
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[2009/12/16 16:41] Dave Coyle: personally i think we're ok with the status quo. we just don't have the mass of passionate people willing and able to volunteer to staff a landing zone.
[2009/12/16 16:41] SpecialAgent Randt: Is the goal to get a lot of users or just a Few Good Users?
[2009/12/16 16:41] Eryn Galen: Well, my impression is that a lot of new ppl expect "just a second SL, but without cost"
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: we are always changing everything around
[2009/12/16 16:41] Arielle Popstar: best thing is we can have organization among the greeters
[2009/12/16 16:41] Adelle Fitzgerald: OSgrid isnt for everyone, and as it stands 99% of people come from Sl, expecting SL, and I think the main problem lies with that
[2009/12/16 16:41] Greybeard Thinker: opens book on programming in the key of C# again lol.
[2009/12/16 16:41] Dave Coyle: some day we'll have the numbers, but we shouldn't kill ourselves in the short term
[2009/12/16 16:41] Greybeard Thinker: agredd Adelle
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: i was thinking about starting a new Freebie Plaza
[2009/12/16 16:41] Hiro Protagonist: we probably do have that mass Dave - the problem is, a sufficient and significant number of them are newbs themselves
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: with a mall style setting
[2009/12/16 16:41] Nebadon Izumi: where people are assigned a parcel
[2009/12/16 16:42] Nebadon Izumi: they get a certain alotment of prims etc..
[2009/12/16 16:42] Widget Whiteberry is Offline
[2009/12/16 16:42] Nebadon Izumi: and we can start laying out a nice freebie area for new people
[2009/12/16 16:42] Nebadon Izumi: so its not so chaotic
[2009/12/16 16:42] Nebadon Izumi: that might help keep more people around
[2009/12/16 16:42] Shez Oyen: yes finding even a decent walk is a chore when you are new
[2009/12/16 16:42] Greybeard Thinker: do like some software makers?
[2009/12/16 16:42] Nebadon Izumi: im bringing over some stuff from SL from the Oni Kenkon mall we had in SL
[2009/12/16 16:42] Greybeard Thinker: don't get to the final part of signup
[2009/12/16 16:43] Marcus Llewellyn: Immediate access to at least a small selection of essential freebies for new people would be a good thing.
[2009/12/16 16:43] Greybeard Thinker: till all EULA is read?
[2009/12/16 16:43] Hiro Protagonist: I personally would like to see all that activity moved in the direction ow the web - wherther in the general store or as oars/iars
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: but id like to see others do similar things around the grid too
[2009/12/16 16:43] Zardoz Firanelli: Is there a mall in the works?
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: nothing started yet
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: but im working it out
[2009/12/16 16:43] Zardoz Firanelli: Whats needed?
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: well 1st get the mall built
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: get it all setup
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: figure out what we will allow
[2009/12/16 16:43] Hiro Protagonist: the thing about putting that stuff on the web is it can be done brutally cheap
[2009/12/16 16:43] Nebadon Izumi: lots to think about
[2009/12/16 16:43] Zardoz Firanelli: Are you looking for Builders?
[2009/12/16 16:44] Key Gruin: how about a seperate General Store deal for newbies
[2009/12/16 16:44] Nebadon Izumi: not really sure yet Zardoz
[2009/12/16 16:44] Eryn Galen: I like the store, Hiro. A lot in one place..
[2009/12/16 16:44] Nebadon Izumi: i havent had much time to put into it yet but its something i want to really do soon
[2009/12/16 16:44] Eryn Galen: I do think we need to work on delivery though, lol
[2009/12/16 16:44] Marcus Llewellyn: The problem with oar/iar is that you must be a simulator operator to use them.
[2009/12/16 16:44] Zardoz Firanelli: Ok if you do go to Zardonia-001 and see what Qandy Saw can do.
[2009/12/16 16:44] Shez Oyen: yes the store is excellent
[2009/12/16 16:44] Greybeard Thinker: the store's delivery boy could be a bit more reliable.
[2009/12/16 16:44] Shez Oyen: absolutely the easist way to find something
[2009/12/16 16:45] Arielle Popstar: and work with other brosewers
[2009/12/16 16:45] Hiro Protagonist: good point re: region operator involvement
[2009/12/16 16:45] Nebadon Izumi: i think one of the requirements of the mall will be everything has to be boxed up nice etc..
[2009/12/16 16:45] Shez Oyen: I'd like to see it expanded a lot!
[2009/12/16 16:45] Nebadon Izumi: with nice boxes that people can easily understand what they are getting etc..
[2009/12/16 16:45] Arielle Popstar: or at least state it only works with mozilla
[2009/12/16 16:45] Nebadon Izumi: might even ask people to include a license of some kind
[2009/12/16 16:45] Greybeard Thinker: waste of time there Neb.
[2009/12/16 16:45] Nebadon Izumi: like BSD or whatever
[2009/12/16 16:45] Dave Coyle: yes, license would be good
[2009/12/16 16:45] Eryn Galen: Re license... I think most ppl just ignore those
[2009/12/16 16:45] Marcus Llewellyn: +1 on license
[2009/12/16 16:45] Greybeard Thinker: yes Eryn
[2009/12/16 16:45] Nebadon Izumi: well
[2009/12/16 16:46] Shez Oyen: Eryn's right
[2009/12/16 16:46] Nebadon Izumi: im not saying it will be restrictive
[2009/12/16 16:46] Eryn Galen: sorry Neb, but its true
[2009/12/16 16:46] Dave Coyle: that's no reason not to list the license
[2009/12/16 16:46] Nebadon Izumi: you are asuming it s a restructive license
[2009/12/16 16:46] Eryn Galen: nope
[2009/12/16 16:46] Nebadon Izumi: restrictive
[2009/12/16 16:46] Marcus Llewellyn: Ignored or not.. they provide some protection for the grid itself.
[2009/12/16 16:46] Eryn Galen: just saying in general
[2009/12/16 16:46] Dave Coyle: and some people will actually read them
[2009/12/16 16:46] Eryn Galen: ok Marcus, valid point
[2009/12/16 16:46] Greybeard Thinker: with deliberately built thief viewers?
[2009/12/16 16:46] Arielle Popstar: license?
[2009/12/16 16:46] Hiro Protagonist: I think a license should be a basic requirement
[2009/12/16 16:46] Zardoz Firanelli: Yes people don't ever care about the perms on items you give them, you see them a few hours later full perm.
[2009/12/16 16:46] Dave Coyle: i'm under no delusions that it will be all, or even most. but some will.
[2009/12/16 16:46] Greybeard Thinker: like Cryoviewer?
[2009/12/16 16:46] Nebadon Izumi: ya im not going to not do something because someone is dumb and decides to ignore things
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: the license will just be there to protect you and the grid mostly
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: i would suggest like BSD or Creative Commons
[2009/12/16 16:47] Greybeard Thinker: CC?
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: doesnt have to restrict anything
[2009/12/16 16:47] Greybeard Thinker: whao.
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: ya CC is fine
[2009/12/16 16:47] Arielle Popstar: what kind of license we talking about?
[2009/12/16 16:47] Hiro Protagonist: content license
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2009/12/16 16:47] Nebadon Izumi: content licnese
[2009/12/16 16:47] Eryn Galen: I think a lot of ppl doing stuff dont know about the different licenses
[2009/12/16 16:48] Nebadon Izumi: for people giving out freebies on plaza mall
[2009/12/16 16:48] Greybeard Thinker: make things free perms or no perms, that simple.
[2009/12/16 16:48] Hiro Protagonist: it need be no more than 'The creator of this content hereby releases it to the common ownership of the public domain"
[2009/12/16 16:48] Nebadon Izumi: its not that simple
[2009/12/16 16:48] Dave Coyle: greybeard: that's not enough
[2009/12/16 16:48] Eryn Galen: exactly.
[2009/12/16 16:48] Dave Coyle: C/M/T doesn't cover all use cases
[2009/12/16 16:48] Greybeard Thinker: ??
[2009/12/16 16:48] Zardoz Firanelli: I totally disagreee with teh full perm thing
[2009/12/16 16:48] Nebadon Izumi: but if its to complicated you dont have to participate either
[2009/12/16 16:48] Greybeard Thinker: true
[2009/12/16 16:48] Dave Coyle: full perm does NOT necessarily mean you can export it to another grid
[2009/12/16 16:48] Nebadon Izumi: this is for Plaza Freebie mall
[2009/12/16 16:48] Marcus Llewellyn: Agreed, Dave... current perms are terrible.
[2009/12/16 16:48] Nebadon Izumi: not for your guys freebie stores
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: you guys can do whatever you think is appropriate on your sims
[2009/12/16 16:49] Hiro Protagonist: Oh yes, we're not talking a broad requirement here
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: it wont be a grid requirement or anything
[2009/12/16 16:49] Hiro Protagonist: put the pitchforks and torches away LOL
[2009/12/16 16:49] Dave Coyle: :)
[2009/12/16 16:49] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe
[2009/12/16 16:49] Eryn Galen: no, my point was that you might want to have some licenses with simple explanations for creators to use
[2009/12/16 16:49] Dave Coyle: eryn: yes, i agree
[2009/12/16 16:49] Zardoz Firanelli: Yes, but it will be hard to get creators without at least giving them credit.
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: i was simply talking about the grid freebie mall if we parcel it up etc..
[2009/12/16 16:49] Marcus Llewellyn: Yes... my understanding is that an officially endorsed OSgrid store should have licenses.
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: and give people small parcel
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: it will be very controlled
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: and not a chaotic garbage dump
[2009/12/16 16:49] Nebadon Izumi: thats my goal
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: some quality stuff for new people
[2009/12/16 16:50] Key Gruin: my brain turns to mush when talk about licensing starts
[2009/12/16 16:50] Eryn Galen: agreed Neb, its a good idea
[2009/12/16 16:50] Greybeard Thinker: yes Key
[2009/12/16 16:50] Hiro Protagonist: most of the official osgrid freebie zones are well, kinda chaotic
[2009/12/16 16:50] Eryn Galen: hehe, exactly my point Key
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: ya
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: very chaotic
[2009/12/16 16:50] Shez Oyen: kinda? Ya think?
[2009/12/16 16:50] Shez Oyen: lol
[2009/12/16 16:50] Greybeard Thinker: keep it simple stoopid is always a good idea
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: we do our best to keep it clean
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: but its a mess
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: i want to get everything boxed
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: so its not just out
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: using 10,000 prims needlessly
[2009/12/16 16:50] Nebadon Izumi: with nice descriptions and docs
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: i wont get rid of the current freebie areas
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: i just want to make one really nice one
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: were we showcase high quality stuff
[2009/12/16 16:51] Marcus Llewellyn: Aww... but I want people to actually see how I cleverly used 100 prims to make the perfect curve in my park bench. ;)
[2009/12/16 16:51] Warin Cascabel: Heh
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: hehe take a nice screenshot
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: hehe
[2009/12/16 16:51] Eryn Galen: hehehe
[2009/12/16 16:51] Greybeard Thinker: heheeh Marc
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: we'll figure it out
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: im still mulling it all over still
[2009/12/16 16:51] Dave Coyle: key: it's like the virtual world version of Goodwin's Law: "As a conversation in a virtual world grows longer, the probability of discussing content licensing approaches 1."
[2009/12/16 16:51] Nebadon Izumi: we have a lot of work to do all around
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: LOL Dave :D
[2009/12/16 16:52] Marcus Llewellyn: You license nazi, Dave. :P
[2009/12/16 16:52] Eryn Galen: willing to help all I can
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: YES FYI SPEAKING OF WORK
[2009/12/16 16:52] Eryn Galen: lol Marcus
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: (shouting intentional)
[2009/12/16 16:52] Greybeard Thinker: yes Hiro San?
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: I've had a lot to do lately
[2009/12/16 16:52] Nebadon Izumi: ya i can post some example licenses for people
[2009/12/16 16:52] Nebadon Izumi: it cant hurt to include it
[2009/12/16 16:52] Eryn Galen: great Neb :)
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: so progress on Bade Plaza's facelift has been slower than anticipated
[2009/12/16 16:52] Nebadon Izumi: its optional
[2009/12/16 16:52] Eryn Galen: ppl might also use that for their own freebie places :)
[2009/12/16 16:52] Hiro Protagonist: also, my main PC did a meltdown excercise and had to be replaced
[2009/12/16 16:53] Marcus Llewellyn: ouch
[2009/12/16 16:53] Greybeard Thinker: we heard about that mate, bad luck.
[2009/12/16 16:53] Hiro Protagonist: so the main transporter still doesnt work, etc
[2009/12/16 16:53] Hiro Protagonist: but fear not, I'll get back on it presently :)
[2009/12/16 16:53] Eryn Galen: :)
[2009/12/16 16:54] Greybeard Thinker: looks damned good Warin
[2009/12/16 16:54] Eryn Galen: It was said before you came Hiro that it might be a good idea to have some kind of label on the Teleport thingy
[2009/12/16 16:54] Warin Cascabel: Thanks, Greybeard
[2009/12/16 16:54] Nebadon Izumi: brb afk a moment phone
[2009/12/16 16:54] Greybeard Thinker: agrees with Eryn and also mentioned it to Neb too.
[2009/12/16 16:54] Hiro Protagonist: well, Idk if anyone has actually looked closely at it, but it has a display panel on it now
[2009/12/16 16:54] Warin Cascabel: I must also report that progress on Orientation Island has been slower than I'd have liked this week, due to a heavier-than-usual work schedule, and other things draining my time. And I too shall get back on that presently.
[2009/12/16 16:55] Hiro Protagonist: it will eventually do all a display panel should do
[2009/12/16 16:55] Hiro Protagonist: (probably and then some :)
[2009/12/16 16:55] Eryn Galen: ooops, since when?
[2009/12/16 16:55] Zardoz Firanelli: Does everyone know the ins and outs of the voice setup here?
[2009/12/16 16:55] Hiro Protagonist: since it's been 90% rewritten
[2009/12/16 16:55] Greybeard Thinker: better check it again myself then too.
[2009/12/16 16:55] Hiro Protagonist: 20% rebuilt
[2009/12/16 16:55] Nebadon Izumi: ok back
[2009/12/16 16:55] Dave Coyle: zardoz: here in this region? or with osgrid/opensim generally?
[2009/12/16 16:55] Hiro Protagonist: it now uses a dialog menu system and detects you automatically when you get in operational range
[2009/12/16 16:56] Zardoz Firanelli: In osgrid, the connection is persitent
[2009/12/16 16:56] Greybeard Thinker: nice Hiro
[2009/12/16 16:56] Hiro Protagonist: but, the teleport targets are not yet set, so beware
[2009/12/16 16:56] Zardoz Firanelli: which is great
[2009/12/16 16:56] Hiro Protagonist: they all take you to the third floor or somesuch
[2009/12/16 16:56] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe Hiro
[2009/12/16 16:56] Eryn Galen: heehehe
[2009/12/16 16:56] Eryn Galen: as long as we get to the newspaper office ;-)
[2009/12/16 16:56] Hiro Protagonist: LOL
[2009/12/16 16:57] Marcus Llewellyn: Take one of Neb's barrels and blow a whole in the window.
[2009/12/16 16:57] Hiro Protagonist: I *hope* everyone here knows how to pan and zoom into structures to find sit targets to let themselves inside
[2009/12/16 16:57] Eryn Galen: lol Marcus
[2009/12/16 16:57] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2009/12/16 16:57] Key Gruin: make 'm all go to the `rst floor ;)
[2009/12/16 16:57] Key Gruin: 1rst
[2009/12/16 16:57] Eryn Galen: hehehehe, yes Key
[2009/12/16 16:57] Greybeard Thinker whispers: what on V Earth are you doing SAR?
[2009/12/16 16:57] Dave Coyle: breakdancing?
[2009/12/16 16:57] SpecialAgent Randt: I think better this way.
[2009/12/16 16:58] Marcus Llewellyn: heh
[2009/12/16 16:58] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe
[2009/12/16 16:58] Eryn Galen: lol
[2009/12/16 16:58] Greybeard Thinker: floor comfy is it?
[2009/12/16 16:58] SpecialAgent Randt: More oxygen down low -- hot air rises.
[2009/12/16 16:58] Nebadon Izumi: lol
[2009/12/16 16:58] Greybeard Thinker: no need to tell an engineer that. lol.
[2009/12/16 16:58] Dave Coyle: ok, we're approaching the 1 hour mark. any last items to discuss?

My viewer froze here and I missed 1-2 minutes of chat --coyled

[2009/12/16 17:00] Hiro Protagonist: she doesnt need permission to be an advocate
[2009/12/16 17:00] Eryn Galen: would it be possible for her to use the board info, the logo and store shirts?
[2009/12/16 17:00] Eryn Galen: got one?
[2009/12/16 17:00] Warin Cascabel: As long as it's not used on something purporting to be officially speaking for OSgrid, Adam says that's fine.
[2009/12/16 17:00] Hiro Protagonist: that may be another matter
[2009/12/16 17:00] Eryn Galen: oh cool :)
[2009/12/16 17:00] Dave Coyle: oh, wow, i missed about 2 mins of chat. weird.
[2009/12/16 17:00] Warin Cascabel: And he says if there's doubt, ask Nebadon to look at it.
[2009/12/16 17:00] Eryn Galen: I will relay that
[2009/12/16 17:00] Eryn Galen: hehe, thats why Im asking
[2009/12/16 17:01] Greybeard Thinker: and make sure people actually understand this grid?
[2009/12/16 17:01] Eryn Galen: cool, will do
[2009/12/16 17:01] Hiro Protagonist: yeah, didnt see that one comin' Eryn ;)
[2009/12/16 17:01] Marcus Llewellyn: I've always been unlcear on the use of the OSgrid logo and stuff.
[2009/12/16 17:01] Eryn Galen: poor Neb, more work ;-)
[2009/12/16 17:01] Warin Cascabel: Oh, crud, I'm sorry I didn't get back to you with the answer, Eryn.
[2009/12/16 17:01] Eryn Galen: I have a friend who wants to advertise the grid in her shop in SL
[2009/12/16 17:01] Dave Coyle: oh, and for those who weren't here at the beginning.... the next two meetings are cancelled since many people are travelling and/or celebrating holidays.
[2009/12/16 17:01] Eryn Galen: lol, thats okay Warin ;-)
[2009/12/16 17:01] Nebadon Izumi: heh
[2009/12/16 17:01] Nebadon Izumi: part of the job
[2009/12/16 17:01] Dave Coyle: for those that didn't make the beginning... the next two meetings are cancelled because many people are travelling and/or celebrating holidays
[2009/12/16 17:01] Dave Coyle: next meeting will be january 7
[2009/12/16 17:02] Dave Coyle: same time/place/day of week
[2009/12/16 17:02] Eryn Galen: One more thing Dave... Will there be more to translate on the Wiki?
[2009/12/16 17:02] Eryn Galen: Im done with the first page
[2009/12/16 17:02] Eryn Galen: hehe
[2009/12/16 17:02] Greybeard Thinker: so for us Aussie's that's Thursday morning smoko time.
[2009/12/16 17:02] Dave Coyle: (00:01 UTC on jan 7..., so that may be jan 6 for you depending on where in the world you are)
[2009/12/16 17:03] Dave Coyle: eryn: yes, i saw that. thanks. i have to pull some more out from the website.
[2009/12/16 17:03] Eryn Galen: okay
[2009/12/16 17:03] Dave Coyle: i'll send you a message via the website when that's ready
[2009/12/16 17:03] Eryn Galen: cool, ok
[2009/12/16 17:03] Eryn Galen: I think it would be a good idea to have one board for help needed for OSGrid things
[2009/12/16 17:03] Eryn Galen: to get more ppl to help
[2009/12/16 17:03] Marcus Llewellyn: Okay... dinner time for me. Thanks, everyone. :)
[2009/12/16 17:04] Dave Coyle: thanks marcus.
[2009/12/16 17:04] Greybeard Thinker: enjoy Marcus.
[2009/12/16 17:04] Dave Coyle: and thanks again everyone for coming.
[2009/12/16 17:04] Monerda Skute: bye Marcus take care
[2009/12/16 17:04] Warin Cascabel: Bye, Marcus
[2009/12/16 17:04] Eryn Galen: bye Marcus
[2009/12/16 17:04] Dave Coyle: meeting is adjourned. but feel free to hang out and chat if you'd like.
[2009/12/16 17:04] Greybeard Thinker: we lost Key again too.
[2009/12/16 17:04] Dave Coyle: too much licensing talk
[2009/12/16 17:04] Eryn Galen: yep
[2009/12/16 17:04] Dave Coyle: he passed out
[2009/12/16 17:04] Greybeard Thinker: hehehe
[2009/12/16 17:04] Eryn Galen: lol Dave
[2009/12/16 17:05] Greybeard Thinker: nah, he crashes more often than a Demo Derby driver.
[2009/12/16 17:05] Hiro Protagonist: allrighty then
[2009/12/16 17:05] Eryn Galen: bye Hiro :)
[2009/12/16 17:05] Greybeard Thinker: ciao Hiro San.
[2009/12/16 17:05] Warin Cascabel: Bye, Hiro
[2009/12/16 17:05] Dave Coyle: bye hiro
[2009/12/16 17:05] Monerda Skute: bye Hiro an take care
[2009/12/16 17:05] Hiro Protagonist: see y'all next time :D
[2009/12/16 17:06] Greybeard Thinker: don't work too hard mate.
[2009/12/16 17:06] Hiro Protagonist waves
[2009/12/16 17:06] Adelle Fitzgerald: cya Hiro
[2009/12/16 17:06] Dave Coyle: i should get going too. see you all around.
[2009/12/16 17:06] Adelle Fitzgerald: bye Dave
[2009/12/16 17:06] Monerda Skute: bye Dave and thanks
[2009/12/16 17:06] Warin Cascabel: Bye, Dave
[2009/12/16 17:06] Eryn Galen: bye Dave
[2009/12/16 17:06] Greybeard Thinker: see ya Dave
[2009/12/16 17:06] Dave Coyle: g'night